great post but you missed something which is, these guys were not rational.they were drunk.and lets not forget the false bravado that comes with being drunk.also if they were law abiding which we all know they were not, since they all had records,they would not have tried to run down the cops, or run from them.and as i stated earlier these guys knew damn well they were being approached by 5-0 the police to use the street term.
Originally posted by Jack White: I'm also not arguing that deadly force wasn't appropriate, but 50 shots seems excessive, doesn't it?. I mean, several bullets went through neighborhood apartment windows and a Port Authority surveillance camera recorded a bullet shattering a window at the AirTrain station a half-block away, narrowly missing two Port Authority patrolmen. Fifty?
But then, I'm a civilian.
You continue to fire until the threat is gone ... JOB WELL DONE NYPD! Thugs need to learn it is not about race it is about obeying the law. If Sean Bell was white this would have never made the news, its a sad world we live in when cops and bad guys have to be defined by color and not as "officer" and "suspect"
Posts: 181 | Location: Toms River NJ | Registered: January 02, 2008
If Sean Bell was white this would have never made the news
Statistically speaking, if Sean Bell were white, it wouldn't have happened in the first place. Statistically.
'Question authority. Think for yourself. Filter out the spin. Engage elected officials critically. Make them defend what they're doing in your name. Derive the truth. Speak truth to power.'
Posts: 2600 | Location: Boston | Registered: April 16, 2005
and if my grandmother had ba--s she would be my grandfather.remember the part about being drunk and not obeying commands? oh and lets not forget the part about trying to run the cop over.
lets not forget the part about trying to run the cop over.
No, I wont. But let's also not forget the police told one story and witnesses told another. While the judge found the police's version to be more credible, at least as to criminal conduct, that doesn't mean they acted properly. Just not criminally.
It seems a hell of a stretch to call it a "job well done".
They're still going to face civil action, which carries much less of a burden of evidence (remember OJ?) for conviction, and the Feds are considering criminal charges of their own.
It ain't over.
'Question authority. Think for yourself. Filter out the spin. Engage elected officials critically. Make them defend what they're doing in your name. Derive the truth. Speak truth to power.'
Posts: 2600 | Location: Boston | Registered: April 16, 2005
As a criminal trial, the verdict was unquestionably correct. The prosecution's witnesses were credibility disasters. The prosecutors also made tactical errors, such as introducing as evidence the detectives' grand jury testimony--this allowed the defense to get their story in evidence without having to testify in court and be subjected to cross examination. In this context, a mistake by the prosecution.
But just because their was no evidence of criminality beyond a reasonable doubt (not even close), it does not mean the detectives acted appropriately. However, that determination belongs in another forum, not a criminal court.
It seems a hell of a stretch to call it a "job well done".
Jack put yourself in the same situation and you are one of the cops and you hear a shot as a car with suspects who are thought to have a gun is coming at a fellow officer ... Do take the time to think and look to see who shot? at the same time you still see the car going at a fellow officer and you hear more shots and keep in mind all these decicions are made in 1/100th of a second
Posts: 181 | Location: Toms River NJ | Registered: January 02, 2008
Do take the time to think and look to see who shot?
Before emptying my weapon, putting in a new clip and emptying it again? Jeez, I would certainly hope so!
'Question authority. Think for yourself. Filter out the spin. Engage elected officials critically. Make them defend what they're doing in your name. Derive the truth. Speak truth to power.'
Posts: 2600 | Location: Boston | Registered: April 16, 2005
Originally posted by bklynkid: great post but you missed something which is, these guys were not rational.they were drunk.and lets not forget the false bravado that comes with being drunk.also if they were law abiding which we all know they were not, since they all had records,they would not have tried to run down the cops, or run from them.and as i stated earlier these guys knew damn well they were being approached by 5-0 the police to use the street term.
I do not know. But was all that recorded on video with sound or is this all eyewitness accounts. Didn't the judgement go in favor of the defendants because the witnesses gave contradictory accounts of the events. Aren't witnesses unreliable, manipulable, biased and subject to false memories. In other words didn't the defendants get the benefit of the doubt?
Originally posted by bklynkid: great post but you missed something which is, these guys were not rational.they were drunk.and lets not forget the false bravado that comes with being drunk.also if they were law abiding which we all know they were not, since they all had records,they would not have tried to run down the cops, or run from them.and as i stated earlier these guys knew damn well they were being approached by 5-0 the police to use the street term.
I do not know. But was all that recorded on video with sound or is this all eyewitness accounts. Didn't the judgement go in favor of the defendants because the witnesses gave contradictory accounts of the events. Aren't witnesses unreliable, manipulable, biased and subject to false memories. In other words didn't the defendants get the benefit of the doubt?
Its togh in NY when it becomes more about race instwead of right and wrong ... According to Al Sharpton and a few other idiots if a Black man is asked to stop by a white cop he doesn't have to and if he decides to run over the same cop the cop should stand down and let the "suspect" go
Posts: 181 | Location: Toms River NJ | Registered: January 02, 2008
in the world of al sharpton i refuse to call him a reverend, blacks are allowed to do as they please with no reguard to the law. he is like pied piper he screams racisim, and his stooges follow.protesting civil disobiedence. or what ever he calls it. do any of those dead beats work? or do their lives revolve around agitating people? get a life
According to Al Sharpton and a few other idiots if a Black man is asked to stop by a white cop he doesn't have to
He's both right and wrong. The right of a police officer to stop and frisk as established in Terry v. Ohio requires 'reasonable suspicion', which is a lower requirement than the probable cause required for search and seizure, but still not a license for a cop to harrass whatever black man he wants, whenever he wants.
In reality, a black man is far more likely to be stopped and frisked than a white man, simply because he is black. The mere fact a man is black, in the minds of some, warrants 'reasonable suspicion'.
'Question authority. Think for yourself. Filter out the spin. Engage elected officials critically. Make them defend what they're doing in your name. Derive the truth. Speak truth to power.'
Posts: 2600 | Location: Boston | Registered: April 16, 2005
keeping people at each others throats is the one and only thing a bum like sharpton lives for.he is no man of the cloth, since reverand,s priests and the like do not spread hatred aka sharpton and people like him.
According to Al Sharpton and a few other idiots if a Black man is asked to stop by a white cop he doesn't have to
He's both right and wrong. The right of a police officer to stop and frisk as established in Terry v. Ohio requires 'reasonable suspicion', which is a lower requirement than the probable cause required for search and seizure, but still not a license for a cop to harrass whatever black man he wants, whenever he wants.
In reality, a black man is far more likely to be stopped and frisked than a white man, simply because he is black. The mere fact a man is black, in the minds of some, warrants 'reasonable suspicion'.
Black or white they were told to stop by the police and decided to try and drive away ... and now a friend is dead! it is better to be stopped and harassed and allow the courts to decide than attend a friends funeral because of stupidity! about 2 months after this event a white "slow" adult was shot in Clifton NJ I'm sure nobody heard of this because he was white ... he was being pulled over because of a seat belt violation! no news no national story because it wasn't whaite and black. All should be viewed as police vs. suspect regardless of color. And as for the black vs white getting stoipped in a major city where 70% of the populatin is not "white" 70 mor minorities will be stopped is you go to a place like essex fells NJ 98% of the people stopped are white because the population is just that its time America got over the black white thing created by the media and those who feel the need to do so to justify bad behavior
Posts: 181 | Location: Toms River NJ | Registered: January 02, 2008
... its time America got over the black white thing created by the media
The "black-white" thing, as you so cavalierly describe it, Bill-NJ, was hardly created by 'the media'. Institutional racism is endemic in America, and is further magnified in far too many of this country's police departments and the actions of officers who have no business wearing a badge and carrying a gun. While I can sometimes understand the reasons behind that mindset, I respectfully suggest your 'rock star' worship of cops needs to be tempered a bit.
'Question authority. Think for yourself. Filter out the spin. Engage elected officials critically. Make them defend what they're doing in your name. Derive the truth. Speak truth to power.'
Posts: 2600 | Location: Boston | Registered: April 16, 2005
... its time America got over the black white thing created by the media
The "black-white" thing, as you so cavalierly describe it, Bill-NJ, was hardly created by 'the media'. Institutional racism is endemic in America, and is further magnified in far too many of this country's police departments and the actions of officers who have no business wearing a badge and carrying a gun. While I can sometimes understand the reasons behind that mindset, I respectfully suggest your 'rock star' worship of cops needs to be tempered a bit.
In that neighborhood in NY the only white people are the police so you cant fault the officer for stopping a blck man. The problem is still the "black man" should obey the officer and allow a court of law to determine what is right and wrong he should also be a law abiding member of society but a black male smoking wed everyday for 4 or 5 years with multiple arrests on his record will never be a credible witness
It is not rock star worship it is respect ... There are probably more guys on the job I think should have badges and guns taken away than not! But in that situation I do not think the cops were wrong. I do think there have been many others where they were wrong as well. The black - white thing may not have been created by the media but they thrive on the story line and it only fuels both sides on the racial issues the media should report police shot s suspect and allow the facts to come out before a racial spin is placed on the case.
Posts: 181 | Location: Toms River NJ | Registered: January 02, 2008
