You all seem to be an intelligent bunch. How do you feel about taxes in general? A poll of sorts.

Do you think the gov't should get to use your money to run to the country? Do you think they need less? Do you think they need more?

Would you be more willing to pay taxes if you could trust that it would be spent effectively?

I hear more and more people say: let me keep more of my money. I just wonder what the motivation is? Is it as simple as: I want more money for cigars? Or is it something deeper?

I for one think taxes are necessary for a diverse, civilized society. The imbalance lies in how rich folk/corporations somehow get out of paying what I think should be their share.

I'm a proponent of the Fair Tax.

I'm for less taxes and less government programs. i.e. conservatism.

quote:

I'm for less taxes and less government programs. i.e. conservatism.

I will second that!

100% for the FairTax

This is perhaps the thorniest issue that we're going to face over the next several years - even more so than some of the "hot-button" social issues.

Our tax code exists in the form it's in because Congress uses the tax code to encourage some behaviors (charitable giving, for example) and penalize others (smoking, as a near and dear example).

Given the above, I believe that a simplified/fair tax will likely not pass, because it will remove a lot of the power that Congress has to influence behavior. Congress is quite jealous of its power...

The only way we have to address this is to elect candidates on their fiscal policy, rather than letting them hide fiscal irresponsibility behind Conservative or Liberal social credentials.

Thoughts?

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I believe that a simplified/fair tax will likely not pass, because it will remove a lot of the power that Congress has to influence behavior. Congress is quite jealous of its power...

Ain't it the truth!

A strong organization needs to be well-funded to remain strong. One does not need to forget the impact of government spending as a large percentage of the GDP, either - typically, and many people don't necessarily like or understand this, the more government spending that takes place, the stronger the economy in the US.

Whether spending is effective or not depends on your political and personal philosophy, and if I voted the b@stards into office, I am probably fine with their spending, regardless as to the drunken-sailor nature of the spending or not.

I am fairly moderate in regard to spending, I believe. I believe that solid business principals, especially cost/results analysis, should be utilized with my taxes. For instance, in the case of insurance, all citizens should have health insurance. The government is not an insurance company, so a combination of administration by private companies combined with public funding is the best route for that goal, in my opinion. The private, capitalist, corporation will put people in several tiers of coverage based on: 1) need; 2) health status; 3) history; 4) behavior, or whatever else the insurance companies use in their actuarial tables.

People want to keep their money for their own use, because if you work hard, you get to play hard. No one wants to work hard to get ahead solely to fund a society of benefits and entitlement. As a citizen, you are entitled to some security and an ability to move forward through education, good health, opportunity; you also have to have a healthy opinion of self-worth to succeed, too.

The problem with such a tremendous corporation, such as the US government is a lack of oversight and rampant abuse - on the service provider and the benefactor sides. I would like to see the US corporation de-centralized and made more state, county, and local oriented so that people in a particular locale could have more of a voice in the flavor of their government. Why should Mississippi be painted with the same brush as Ohio? There are different goals, mores, education, stories in each place. While MS might need to be a bit more socialized to grow, Ohio could possibly be more capitalist and individualistic.

AFTER ALL OF THAT -

As Presley, I am a fan of a consumption tax - Huckabee calls his plan the Fair Tax. However, I believe that there should be some graduation of the tax rates: groceries/raw food and home cleaning products should probably be taxed at a lower rate. At the same time, a $50K automobile should probably be taxed more than a $2000 automobile on a percentage scale - a luxury tax is fair, in my opinion. You work hard, you get to play hard, but you also will pay incrementally more for your goods.

If any of you have the time and do not mind watching a video on your computer. If you go to Google and Type in: America Freedom to Fascism, you will see an awesome video about taxes and stuff like that. You will learn alot about where you money goes, and what taxes pay for what and much more.(You can rent it somewhere if you can find it, but Google has it under the videos for free)

I love this film, I have watched it in my Sociology class and on the Internet several times. Its a great movie with a powerful message. Aaron Russo the director died a couple years after releasing this film.

Every year about this time my wife and I go to our tax attorney with meticulous spreadsheets of categorized expenses - spreadsheets that take probably 40 hours to put together. We wait, we sweat, we write the guy an exorbitant check - then write another check to the dad-gum gub'ment.

If the IRS sent thugs to my house every April 15th who would beat me up and clean out my house of valuables, it would be a significant improvement.

Scotto, actually you're on to something. If everybody still had to write out their entire tax check on 4/15, I believe that we'd see a real revolution.

Withholding-- originally implemented as a temporary wartime measure; and surprise! they later forgot the temporary part-- has been the engine that drives the malignant growth of government and bureaucracy.

Now, people who bother to look at their return see that big number on Line 63 (neat how it isn't placed on the bottom line of the return, huh?), but it's almost a theoretical thing to them, since most if not all of it has been slowly bled from them through withholding. Imagine if middle-class folks had to write 20, 30, 40, 50K or higher checks to their friends in Washington on April 15th?

I'm a big fan of the Fair Tax theory too. I would also like to see some sort of re-organization of how states tax their residents.

Yep - I just did mine over the weekend, and the total (State/Federal) was well over $30k.

I agree, if we didn't have incremental witholding and everyone had to write that check every year, there'd be changes, pronto.

I'm a more or less salaried schmuck, so I pay withholding on much of my income. My wife, on the other hand, is a self-employed investor with about a dozen LLC's to her name. This means there are always taxes to pay on April 15th.

Worse than that, though, are when we have to shell out for "projected taxes" for the next year. Thus, if you have a really good year, you have to pay the government in advance for what you might earn in the next year based on the previous year's figures.

What sucks is that if you're self employed and want to make sure you're doing the impossibly complicated taxes correctly, you have to shell out for a tax attorney (most accountants can't even handle it). If you choose the right one, you can sometimes get more back than you shell out, but not always.

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Originally posted by Scottological:
... you have to shell out for a tax attorney (most accountants can't even handle it). If you choose the right one, you can sometimes get more back than you shell out, but not always.

Dam**d lawyers! I say, kill 'em all! Except the retired ones.

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Worse than that, though, are when we have to shell out for "projected taxes" for the next year. Thus, if you have a really good year, you have to pay the government in advance for what you might earn in the next year based on the previous year's figures.

Same here. We pay our estimated taxes every quarter, but it always seems like we could skip a quarter, because we get a good chunk back. My wife has a similar situation as yours with the LLC's (4) and property sales...

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Originally posted by SamuraiJack:
The imbalance lies in how rich folk/corporations somehow get out of paying what I think should be their share.

That's too funny. What's their fair share?

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Originally posted by csmithnj:

quote:

Originally posted by SamuraiJack:
The imbalance lies in how rich folk/corporations somehow get out of paying what I think should be their share.

That's too funny. What's their fair share?

Do you think he's even aware of the percentage of total taxes collected that is paid by the top five percent of taxpayers?

quote:

Originally posted by SamuraiJack:
You all seem to be an intelligent bunch. How do you feel about taxes in general? A poll of sorts.

Do you think the gov't should get to use your money to run to the country? Do you think they need less? Do you think they need more?

Would you be more willing to pay taxes if you could trust that it would be spent effectively?

I hear more and more people say: let me keep more of my money. I just wonder what the motivation is? Is it as simple as: I want more money for cigars? Or is it something deeper?

I for one think taxes are necessary for a diverse, civilized society. The imbalance lies in how rich folk/corporations somehow get out of paying what I think should be their share.

My thoughts in order:
Govt needs some of my money to run...Or, perhaps I should say, I am willing to contribute for physical safety, national security, and infrastructure, in a broad sense.

I don't think we can ever consider "effectively" because it's a subjective term used to describe an objective action...what I think is effecitve will most likely differe from everyone else in some regard.

When I say "Let me keep more of my money," I refer to things like Social Security (average return over 100 years...something like 3%...average return in the market...something like 9%)...education, should I have kids, I'd want the option to send them to public or private schools, and only pay for where they go...I can insure myself better and more effectively than government (including workers compensation)...and I'd rather put my money in local govenrments where I have more immediate influence then at a national level.

I don't think anyone should be taxed more for being a smart business person or a successful person...those huge companies not only pay thier share, but also contribute in immeasurable ways...

Just my thoughts...have at 'em...

jag

quote:

Originally posted by minalpharetta:
Do you think he's even aware of the percentage of total taxes collected that is paid by the top five percent of taxpayers?

No.