The petroleum industry is already plotting a way around this. Since there is a carbon credit required when the oil is refined and when the gasoline is sold, the refiners will off shore refining operations. They go to places like Mexico and the Carribean where environment standards are even lower then they are here, thus more pollution. They will then import the fuel and only pass on the carbon credit cost at the point of sale while the sale price includes the cost of import and transportation. Not to mention those locales are more subject to hurricanes then other refining locations, prices will become more volatile.
Thus, there will be no real reduction in foreign dependance only higher energy costs born by the citizens who are least capable of supporting it. Way to go homey.
Originally posted by jagmqt: I'm willing to concede that emissions impact our environment...but I don't purport to know what that impact is or to what extent it needs to be controlled.
Does it concern you that the GW crowd tries to silence debate over it?
Well, they did and they didn't...
While the some in the circle challenged the impact of global warming, there was a decision in, 2007, Massachusetts v. EPA, where the Bush EPA didn't necessarily challenge the states argument that CO2 (and other greenhouse gasses) contributed to global warming, and global warming was detrimental to human health.
The case ultimately decided the EPA had authority to regulate CO2 under the Clean Air Act, and it must articulate it's reasons for not regulating.
But in a courtroom, especially an appeal to the SCOTUS, if the opponent says "global warming creates health risks," and you don't challenge the point, it's effectively conceeding the point.
So back to the beginning of this, the GW crew was on both sides of the issue...
jag
quote:
We should be too big to take offense and too noble to give it. ~ Abraham Lincoln
Posts: 2226 | Location: Grand Rapids, MI | Registered: September 15, 2006
Al Gore will not debate his propaganda and the Dems refused to have any counter to the pro GW testimony they provided a month or so ago in thinitialal stages of this.
Originally posted by Vision: They didn't and they don't.
Al Gore will not debate his propaganda and the Dems refused to have any counter to the pro GW testimony they provided a month or so ago in thinitialal stages of this.
It's criminal.
All of this may be irrelevant. I'm familiary with environmental law, and regulation of CO2 under the Clean Air Act. I believe the cap/trade legislation was passed amending a public utilities act. I don't know anything about the public utilities act, and it may not be premised as a prevention for global warming within that act at all.
jag
quote:
We should be too big to take offense and too noble to give it. ~ Abraham Lincoln
Posts: 2226 | Location: Grand Rapids, MI | Registered: September 15, 2006
Originally posted by thaterp: im just waiting for the day we figure out fission, then all of this is really a moot point.
Nuclear fission of uranium has been and is being used in hundreds of nuclear reactors to make steam to power turbines in electrical power plants, ships and submarines.
Fusion of hydrogen however has only been successfully used in thermonuclear weapons. In this case it is staged with plutonium and uranium fission devices.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: hydragoat,
Originally posted by thaterp: im just waiting for the day we figure out fission, then all of this is really a moot point.
Nuclear fission of uranium has been and is being used in hundreds of nuclear reactors to make steam to power turbines in electrical power plants, ships and submarines.
Fusion of hydrogen however has only been successfully used in thermonuclear weapons. In this case it is staged with plutonium and uranium fission devices.
yea, i meant fusion, the combining of hydrogen atoms to a helium atom.
I live in Elizabeth so we are not too far away from each other. Would you like to get together and have a smoke? If you would email me at adcp3fe@yahoo.com
“ Baseball? It's just a game. As simple as a ball and a bat, yet as complex as the American spirit it symbolizes. It's a sport, a business, and sometimes even a religion." -Ernie Harwell
Posts: 1074 | Location: Colorado | Registered: March 20, 2008
Originally posted by Raoul in Colorado: If you like what Robert Mugabe did to Zimbabwe, you'll love what Obama and the democRats are doing to the U.S....Zimbabwe is our future....
Originally posted by Raoul in Colorado: If you like what Robert Mugabe did to Zimbabwe, you'll love what Obama and the democRats are doing to the U.S....Zimbabwe is our future....
wat?!?!
Mugabe is the black ruler of the formerly white ruled Rhodesia now called Zimbabwe.
Obama is half black half white. So I guess Raoul is playing on the half black.
Now if Hillary had been the candidate & won, Raoul would have made a comparison with Indira Ghandi or Benazir Bhutto of India and Pakistan respectively. In other words we are headed to a future like India or Pakistan. Which when I think about it is not unlikely.
Interestingly both Indira and Benazir were assassinated. I doubt that even Raoul cheered this. However one never knows.
