I did a search for this question, but was unsuccessful, so I hope that posting this isn't redundant.
I've found that, in reviews, tasters note a presence of "young tobacco." From what I've been reading on these forums, young tobacco isn't yet "ready" to be put into a cigar. How do you know you're tasting young tobacco?
Posts: 22 | Location: New York, NY | Registered: August 05, 2004
I’m assuming young tobacco refers to tobacco that hasn’t completed it’s fermentation. If that’s true, one sign of poorly fermented tobacco is the presence of ammonia. A slight presence may be okay, but if it’s strong, I would move on to something else.
In heaven there ain't no beer, that's why I drink it here.
quote:Originally posted by jgharakhanian: I did a search for this question, but was unsuccessful, so I hope that posting this isn't redundant.
I've found that, in reviews, tasters note a presence of "young tobacco." From what I've been reading on these forums, young tobacco isn't yet "ready" to be put into a cigar. How do you know you're tasting young tobacco?
First off is gharakhanian your name or did you just mash down a bunch of keys when CA said "enter screen name here?"
As for the topic of young tobacco, there are two types of "young" or "green" tobacco.
First, tobacco that was not properly processed, (i.e. picked too soon, not dried properly, not feremnted properly, etc.) can taste young. These cigars will not improve much no matter how long you age them.
Secondly, tobacco that might have been processed right but needs a bit of aging may have been used in a cigar. Sometimes these cigars improve with age.
For instance I find Mayorgas, a cheap brand with not much aging on the finished product, just don't taste as good fresh out of the box. The have some wet, green type flavors to them, reminiscent of wet grass. After a few months to a year they taste great, comparable to a Padron regular line in my opinion.
If you are tasting some grassy, sour notes you might be smoking the latter type. Put some away and see if they improve. If the cigar has grassy or sour notes and a faint hint of ammonia, you are smoking the first type and just chuck it. Nothing can save it.
BDSD is right on the money. Grassy, sour cigars that smell and taste of ammonia are usually made from undercured tobacco rolled too soon (usually by novice rollers).
Spend the money and smoke good cigars
Doc ***** Tobacco is a filthy weed, I like it...
SNOB Member 1033 1/3
Posts: 8980 | Location: New York City | Registered: May 02, 2002
First off is gharakhanian your name or did you just mash down a bunch of keys when CA said "enter screen name here?"
Ha! My name is Jeff Gharakhanian. But I'm not upset--I've actually heard that same comment a million times. Along with any other joke regarding the unusual length of my last name.
Thanks a lot for the info!
Posts: 22 | Location: New York, NY | Registered: August 05, 2004
Nice post BinDer... The only thing I would add is that ANY amount of ammonia present in a finished product is a bad thing. Tobacco should be fermented, dried, and aged before it is rolled. No amount of ammonia should be tolerated, even in a cheap cigar.
quote:Originally posted by tarheel fan: Nice post BinDer... The only thing I would add is that ANY amount of ammonia present in a finished product is a bad thing. Tobacco should be fermented, dried, and aged before it is rolled. No amount of ammonia should be tolerated, even in a cheap cigar.
The couple times I experience ammonia with a cigar was not a pleasant experience. I remember the cheap bundle well. I have read more than once that some cigars can have a very slight ammonia aroma and that's OK since it will dissipate over time. I remember challendging this since my understanding ammonia is released during the fermentation process. Since I never experience this first hand except for the bundle, I'm curious as to what is correct.
In heaven there ain't no beer, that's why I drink it here.
There are different reasons for fermentation, but one of the most important reason is to release the ammonia from the tobacco. The ammonia in the tobacco creates very acrid, harsh tastes which make the tobacco unsmokeable. There is no benefit from keeping the tobacco 'underfermented' to keep a little ammonia. It doesn't help the cigar age or make it 'last longer'. Like you said, most CHEAP bundles aren't fermented long enough because they sell so fast that the manufacturer sells them soooo fast. Of course there are other reasons for fermentation such as color, tastes of the tobacco, etc.
quote:Originally posted by Smok'em: [QUOTE]Originally posted by tarheel fan: Nice post BinDer... The only thing I would add is that ANY amount of ammonia present in a finished product is a bad thing. Tobacco should be fermented, dried, and aged before it is rolled. No amount of ammonia should be tolerated, even in a cheap cigar.
The couple times I experience ammonia with a cigar was not a pleasant experience. I remember the cheap bundle well. I have read more than once that some cigars can have a very slight ammonia aroma and that's OK since it will dissipate over time. I remember challendging this since my understanding ammonia is released during the fermentation process. Since I never experience this first hand except for the bundle, I'm curious as to what is correct.
QUOTE]
Oddly enough I have had several boxes of Cuban's exhibit this upon first opening the box. One particular box was purchased in London at a very reputable shop, so I'm sure they weren't fakes. The others came from Switzerland, but from a reputable source. The odor was faint and dissipated quickly, but it was defintely present. The cigars always smoke fine, so I'm not sure what causes that.
Ammonia is a by-product of anaerobic (no air) decompositon. Don't believe me? Cover a pile of lawn clippings completely with plastic sheeting and sniff after a couple of weeks.
Since cigars are vegatative matter they are never REALLY done decomposing. It's just that at the temps and humidity that we keep them they decompose very, very slowly. Perhaps in an airtight box, under the right conditions the tobacco gives off some residual ammonia.
But yes, detectable quantities of ammonia in a cigar are not a good sign. If the smell lasts much longer after you open the box and they air out a bit, I'd be very suspect.
You mean you would purchase a bundle and they would smell of ammonia pre-light?
I've been noticing this sweet-n-sour/aerosol taste with some cigars I've smoked. I've been told that's due to my high humidity. I've also read that too high of humidity brings out ammonia flavors in cigars. Is that true?
Seems like when I buy cigars at the local tobacconist, they taste excellent as long as I smoke them before they go into the humi for long periods of time. But then again, my humidity was at 86% for a month.
My humidor is a beautifully well-made one that I paid good money for. So I'm always confused if I'm purchasing cigars that just need a couple of months to marinate in the humi, or if my humidity is just so high that it's making my cigars taste subpar.
This happens to a lot of cigars I purchase, like CAOs, Padrons, Punches--you name it. So it's not that I'm buying crappy cigars.
Posts: 22 | Location: New York, NY | Registered: August 05, 2004
