.......we have an anthem, a flag, a football team, a constitution, a capital BUT what would you say is america's course ?
the week before last year's 4th of july, i asked the usga the same question, and shall share their response(s), but first, i thought i would pose the question here and obtain your responses.
FYI, the general consensus last year, was that the course should be available to the public, which eliminates Augusta, although at green fees at $500 per round at Pebble Beach, that course could hardly be considered "available" to many, if not most, of the golfing "public"
this became the overriding constraint, as many of the historically prominent clubs, if they still exist, are predominantly exclusively private and not "available" to the public
Otherwise, Pinehurst #2. You can still go play it during the off season at a steal - usually a little over $200 gets you a nights stay at the Carolina Inn and a round on #2 the next morning.
___
Warm weather. Salt air. Cold beer. Big Cigar.
Posts: 627 | Location: Charlotte, NC, USA | Registered: February 16, 2004
Agree it must be "public", must be a major venue (preferably a US Open), and must be within the realm of the "average guy", so I second Pinehurst #2...you can even walk on during the off season...I find it more accessable than Bethpage or Torrey Pines for non-locals...it also has more history. The USGA has been using more true munis in its current and future rota, but #2 is a true gem.
The risk of kicking butt is you get some crap on your shoe
well, last year, i don't remember pinehurst # 2 being considered, maybe it was a bias against donald ross, or any single architect or else the general flap about the surrounding poor area
if i remember correctly, the contenders were - National Golf Links of America St Andrew's (Yonkers NY) The Country Club Chicago Golf Club and various other early golf clubs, which alternately, hosted inaugural championships and generally promoted the introduction of the game to America
my personal pick would be The Country Club, as the 1913 championship was evidently the spark that ignited nationwide interest by golf fanantics and the otherwise uninitiated alike - but again is not playable by the "public" so i am still wondering what is "America's Course"
is this question really saying only the lucky few can access our golf heritage ?
anyone can own a chevy or have a piece of apple pie or fly the flag or root for dallas cowboys, but what is there for the "public" golfers ?
considering how it is in england and scotland, that all can enjoy the history and tradition and heritage first hand, it seems sad - no ?
those are all great tracks (I've played National and St. Andrews - which is outdated), but none have hosted a major in recent years, and except for St. Andrew's, they are pretty hard to get in. I'll go with a place with a mix of history, class, design pedigree, and accessibility...which leads me back to Pinehurst.
The risk of kicking butt is you get some crap on your shoe
well, last year, i don't remember pinehurst # 2 being considered, maybe it was a bias against donald ross, or any single architect or else the general flap about the surrounding poor area
if i remember correctly, the contenders were - National Golf Links of America St Andrew's (Yonkers NY) The Country Club Chicago Golf Club frankD
Wow...talk about a bias...the Northeast seems to be overly represented in that list.
IMO, #2 has to be considered. It's public, in an area with a lot of golf history/tradition. It's hosted the Open many times. Seems to meet all the criteria and it's likely on the "must play" list of most golfers.
the bias, was unintentional as the usga historians i discussed this with concentrated on the earlier days, and of course, the northeast was where the golf population was at that time
actually, pebble beach did come up quite often but was considered as a contemporary course as compared to the formative years of the game
moreover, when asking the same question about canada, many courses named were in the greater northwest, which was accessable by early train transportation similar to migrations to florida in the US
pinehurst #2 was not part of the discussion last year that i remember and i'm glad it's being raised here
frankie...it was about 10 years ago I played St. Andrews...I do not remember any homes...there were 2 new holes designed by Jack Nicklaus...everything else was original...the club has not kept pace with the other early American clubs on the list in terms of design....National is still a great golf course for anybody's game, and the CC had the Ryder Cup recently...Chicago is supposed to be still relevant...
to me, the architect is a big deal...Tillinghast, MacKenzie, McDonald, Ross would be the main contenders.
The risk of kicking butt is you get some crap on your shoe
There are few places where the experience matches the expectation set by media, legend, history, etc.
Pebble Beach is even more awe inspiring in person. #2 is the same way. Walking that course with a caddie is one of the best (if not the best) golf experiences I have had. Walk up 18 with that clubhouse in the background... words cannot describe.
___
Warm weather. Salt air. Cold beer. Big Cigar.
Posts: 627 | Location: Charlotte, NC, USA | Registered: February 16, 2004
why do you guys think there was no early efforts to present golf to the common people ?
after all, the examples from england, scotland, france, all endorsed the game to the public in a way similar to public libraries, whereby the access should be unrestricted to all people
-there certainly was no profit motive back then
-there certainly was plenty of land
-there certainly was a population not far removed from european roots
-there certainly were no regal elitist shroud about the game and in fact was looked down upon at most private clubs it was introduced to (as most private clubs were exclusively for fox hunting and other royal sports - not golf)
frankie...I've never played Sprain Lake...have managed to get invited to outings at lots of places in Westchester county over the years, including famous ones like Winged Foot, Quaker Ridge, Westchester and Sleepy Hollow. Broke 90 for the first time at Leewood (Babe Ruth's old club).
Most of my public course play has been in NJ on Morris County, Union County and Essex County courses. NJ doesn't have the state courses that NY does, and nothing like Bethpage or Montauk Downs, although some of the Monmouth county courses come close (they say).
The risk of kicking butt is you get some crap on your shoe
well on the jersey side is spook rock ! and with the new "walking" bridge over the hudson to open in a few weeks, its readily accessable !
i've made a special trip to jersey recently just to play the architect's course (golf digest's whitten being the conductor of a course layout that features a different architects design incorporated into each hole of the course - ross has two holes most all others have one each) - otherwise, like westchester and long island, as well as connecticut, in new jersey the best are private
my area favorite overall in any season for layout, nature, value and accessability is CASPERKILL in poughkeepsie (it's the old IBM CC)
L O L - i caddied at Leewood a couple of times, back in the day, which is the reason i could tell jack that ferry point would not be built for a few years, but that's another story ! the last time i played Leewood was oct 11 2001, exactly one month after 9/11, in a salesian high school charity event for retiring basketball coach, father jim - i flew in from FLA, and joined a number of my buddies who played on the salesian baskeball team who came in from MD, PA and CT
i'm familiar with westchester cc, as a frequent guest of a wcc board member i worked for, and spectator since the manny hanny / am-ex pro tournaments (held from 1964 until last year) and the last time i was on the sleepy hollow property, bill murray, a member, caddied for a girl in the USGA womens am - i like that course very much but never played it
my "home" course during high school was siwanoy which we played most mondays and wednesdays
i'm less familiar with those other courses but i know of them
the reason i asked about sprain lake is it's an architectural wonder how a layout on a strip of land canting 45 degrees the entire lenght could have been designed to be as playable as it is - we played it back then most fridays (and its near st andrew's, about three miles down jackson ave)
well on the jersey side is spook rock ! and with the new "walking" bridge over the hudson to open in a few weeks, its readily accessable !
i've made a special trip to jersey recently just to play the architect's course (golf digest's whitten being the conductor of a course layout that features a different architects design incorporated into each hole of the course - ross has two holes most all others have one each) - otherwise, like westchester and long island, as well as connecticut, in new jersey the best are private
my area favorite overall in any season for layout, nature, value and accessability is CASPERKILL in poughkeepsie (it's the old IBM CC)
L O L - i caddied at Leewood a couple of times, back in the day, which is the reason i could tell jack that ferry point would not be built for a few years, but that's another story ! the last time i played Leewood was oct 11 2001, exactly one month after 9/11, in a salesian high school charity event for retiring basketball coach, father jim - i flew in from FLA, and joined a number of my buddies who played on the salesian baskeball team who came in from MD, PA and CT
i'm familiar with westchester cc, as a frequent guest of a wcc board member i worked for, and spectator since the manny hanny / am-ex pro tournaments (held from 1964 until last year) and the last time i was on the sleepy hollow property, bill murray, a member, caddied for a girl in the USGA womens am - i like that course very much but never played it
my "home" course during high school was siwanoy which we played most mondays and wednesdays
i'm less familiar with those other courses but i know of them
the reason i asked about sprain lake is it's an architectural wonder how a layout on a strip of land canting 45 degrees the entire lenght could have been designed to be as playable as it is - we played it back then most fridays (and its near st andrew's, about three miles down jackson ave)
so many courses, so few days to play
anyway be well
frankD
Frank. X 2 for Casperkill. Casperkill is what I consider my "home course", and I live in NYC (we probably pass a few dozen courses on the way up to Poughkeepsie)). Great course indeed. It's got it all: elevation changes, forced carries, blind T shots etc. We try to play it once a week and have no problems getting on. Very few courses in the NYC Metro area and beyond can come close IMO.
Mike
"Enjoy Every Sandwich" Warren Zevon
Posts: 519 | Location: NYC | Registered: August 14, 2008
frankie...Architects is a great course! Lot's of fun, with many cool holes. Broke 90 there for the second time, lol. They also have a decent small cigar collection, with lot's of Fuentes. Haven't eaten at the clubhouse other than a dog at the turn, but it looks nice. I'm about 90 minutes away to the east. If it was half that, I'd consider joining. Think an annual all in membership is around $4500. Not bad if you live nearby and can hit balls, practice, and play 40 rounds...
The risk of kicking butt is you get some crap on your shoe
i could only imagine, in aggregate, how many damn IBM computers were sold on that course - only carneige selling us steel to schwab on st andrew's in yonkers could be a bigger deal
i luv everything about the place and i could go on and on about it
the unpretentious country club atmosphere, the people who play there, the embedded sam snead logo golf ball i found there, the friendly first hole steep slope down, the birch trees, the deer, the hybrid club with each shirt logo purchased, the RTJ layout, the ninth hole elevation ! and that's just the front nine - see i told you
i'm considering buying a place up there so i have an excuse to go more often but then i would miss the roller coster narrow parkway ride and passing the cow farm, the mountain views, the trees, no truck though
as for food, across the street, just north near the marriott courtyard motel is COYOTE GRILL you might want to try
frankD
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