Leather. My tobacconist says he doesn't like cigars with leathery flavors because he got bored when he was little playing outfield and would chew on his leather baseball mit and that reminds him of that taste.
Posts: 334 | Location: Corpus Christi, Texas | Registered: May 08, 2007
Originally posted by Robert Smith: ...but in the end we'll likely both agree that we've smoked a wonderful cigar and that we really enjoyed the time spent smoking it. In the end that's all that really matters, I think the hints of this and that just help you reach that point easier, and also helps you to know what you like and with that you'll spend less time smoking less enjoyable cigars and more time w/ good ones...
Well said, Robert.
Posts: 387 | Location: New England | Registered: May 02, 2003
Posted November 03, 2006 11:03 PM Let me preface this view by stating from the beginning; I am not a cigar aficionado. I am in fact a cigar apprecionado, indulging in a fine smoke occasionally. I hear much talk in the cigar world of flavor. I’m not talking about bouquet, scent or aroma which is a function of the olfactory membrane and being quite different from the function of taste but closely related.
There is talk about woody flavor, cedar, leather, earthy. I would like to know when was the last time any of you had any wood, cedar sap, leather or dirt for breakfast or lunch? How about sole of shoe for dinner?
The above referenced flavors have more to do with creative marketing and overactive imaginations of cigar manufacturers and Madison Avenue than they do with the flavor of burning tobacco leaves. Which, by the way, have a distinct flavor of...burning tobacco leaves, what else!
I would state that when we next enjoy our favorite smoke; instead of trying to imagine descriptive adjectives implanted subliminally in our subconscious mind by cigar manufacturers and slick Madison Avenue, just enjoy your smoke and simply make-up your mind whether you liked it or not. Good cigar or bad cigar, now that we can all understand without question. After all, it really is subjective and no two people perceptive the same cigar alike.
Well Said. I as you don't taste all those creative flavors. All i taste is tobacco i either like a cigar or i toss it.
"Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God" -Thomas Jefferson
"The tree of freedom must be nurtured from time to time with the blood of its patriots" -Thomas Jefferson
"When the Government Fears the People, There is Liberty; When the People Fear the Government, There is Tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 3723 | Location: Reggio di Calabria, Italy / New York United States | Registered: July 12, 2007
Maybe we are too dumb or too smart, or maybe our palate is underdeveloped, not sufficiently sophisticated as some may suggest.
Maybe after smoking 6,000 cigars and making the cigar makers weathly, our palate will be sophisticated enough to discern the subtle nuances of flavor... hmmm?
Maybe we are too dumb or too smart, or maybe our palate is underdeveloped, not sufficiently sophisticated as some may suggest.
Maybe after smoking 6,000 cigars and making the cigar makers weathly, our palate will be sophisticated enough to discern the subtle nuances of flavor... hmmm?
"No one can tell me what is a good cigar--for me. I am the only judge... There are no standards--no real standards. Each man's preference is the only standard for him, the only one which he can accept, the only one which can command him." -- Mark Twain[/quote]
I have been smoking 2 cigars a day for the past 35 yrs you do the math.Still can't get all those flavors.As for a good cigar as you have said no one can judge but the person smoking it.A lot of it is market hype.I think people sort of like to fit in and don't want to admit they cant taste all that crap either.Or maybe we are just a couple of Cave Men with under developed senses.
"Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God" -Thomas Jefferson
"The tree of freedom must be nurtured from time to time with the blood of its patriots" -Thomas Jefferson
"When the Government Fears the People, There is Liberty; When the People Fear the Government, There is Tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 3723 | Location: Reggio di Calabria, Italy / New York United States | Registered: July 12, 2007
Originally posted by IB Vitola: In closing, I'm only floating these ideas to promote a lively discussion. I am not anti-smoking, anti-cigar manufacturer or anti-anything for that matter. I’m only sharing an experience with the forum readers.
I welome your thoughts.
You welcome our thoughts, but then seem to act offended when people disagree with you or present elaboration on your subject?
So much for a lively discussion.....
RW
When your bulldog barks and your canary sings, You're out there with winners.. It's good to be King.
Originally posted by IB Vitola: In closing, I'm only floating these ideas to promote a lively discussion. I am not anti-smoking, anti-cigar manufacturer or anti-anything for that matter. I’m only sharing an experience with the forum readers.
I welome your thoughts.
You welcome our thoughts, but then seem to act offended when people disagree with you or present elaboration on your subject?
So much for a lively discussion.....
RW
I'm sorry Ravenwood, but when was I offended? and it is not MY subject. What you read on your screen is just words and the power of conveying an idea with emotion is lost, thats the naure of human communication, its less than perfect.
Am afraid you are reading into it something that is not there (me being offended).
IF I WRITE IN ALL UPPERCASE LETTERS DOESN'T MEAN I'M YELLING! unless that's the way you want to read it.
As for a lively discussion, that's just what I think it is. We can both be gentlemen and agree to disagree on an issue, that's civilized and that's ok!
Originally posted by IB Vitola: In closing, I'm only floating these ideas to promote a lively discussion. I am not anti-smoking, anti-cigar manufacturer or anti-anything for that matter. I’m only sharing an experience with the forum readers.
I welome your thoughts.
You welcome our thoughts, but then seem to act offended when people disagree with you or present elaboration on your subject?
So much for a lively discussion.....
RW
I'm sorry Ravenwood, but when was I offended? and it is not MY subject. What you read on your screen is just words and the power of conveying an idea with emotion is lost, thats the naure of human communication, its less than perfect.
Am afraid you are reading into it something that is not there (me being offended).
IF I WRITE IN ALL UPPERCASE LETTERS DOESN'T MEAN I'M YELLING! unless that's the way you want to read it.
As for a lively discussion, that's just what I think it is. We can both be gentlemen and agree to disagree on an issue, that's civilized and that's ok!
Lol Ok……your logic is unassailable!
You started this thread but this is not your subject…….
I did not detect any sarcasm that would hint at offense haven been taken…
I may or may not actually be seeing these words…..
I should forget that 2+2=4, that is only my interpretation….(very Orwellian there!)
As Gentlemen, we agree to disagree…..
Got it.
RW
When your bulldog barks and your canary sings, You're out there with winners.. It's good to be King.
I can't count that high, but, I think I know your problem. Your taste buds are burned out LOL! No wonder you can't discern the cedar from the leather.
"Advertising may be described as the science of arresting the human intelligence long enough to get money from it." - Stephen Leacock
To IB Vitola Ya Think? Or could it be that i have a dead imagination. I unlike a child can not see or smell what is not there. These are interesting facts must re search more. Stay well my friend keep in touch.
"Resistance to tyranny is obedience to God" -Thomas Jefferson
"The tree of freedom must be nurtured from time to time with the blood of its patriots" -Thomas Jefferson
"When the Government Fears the People, There is Liberty; When the People Fear the Government, There is Tyranny." - Thomas Jefferson
Posts: 3723 | Location: Reggio di Calabria, Italy / New York United States | Registered: July 12, 2007
[QUOTE] To IB Vitola Ya Think? Or could it be that i have a dead imagination. I unlike a child can not see or smell what is not there. These are interesting facts must re search more. Stay well my friend keep in touch.[QUOTE]
Sheepshead;
Your imagination is fine and a great sense of humour and a contributor to lively discussion. As has been mentioned by others in this forum, many of the posts are pretentious and many believe they are "Cigar Aficionados" - few are; or are wannabees. I for one am NOT IMPRESSED by these people.
"No one means all he says, and yet very few say all they mean, for words are slippery and thought is viscous." Not my original quote.
Stay well and thanks for your words "Stay well my friend keep in touch" - your words.
Originally posted by IB Vitola: [QUOTE] I should forget that 2+2=4, that is only my interpretation….(very Orwellian there!) [QUOTE]
RW; Orwellian? I do not think you know the meaning of Orwellian, look it up and explain to me how it applies to your arguement.
Dumb in California.
Your right, considering the subject at hand, I should not have expected you to detect subtleties.
The most intersting thing is that in my original post I tended to agree at least in part to your supposition.
I just don't agree with someone who starts a discussion thread and uses thinly veiled sarcasm when someone dares to disagree with them. I find it childish.
Perhaps I am wrong. It wouldn't be the first time and I can live with it.
RW
This message has been edited. Last edited by: Ravenwood,
When your bulldog barks and your canary sings, You're out there with winners.. It's good to be King.
Originally posted by IB Vitola: [QUOTE] I should forget that 2+2=4, that is only my interpretation….(very Orwellian there!) [QUOTE]
RW; Orwellian? I do not think you know the meaning of Orwellian, look it up and explain to me how it applies to your arguement.
Dumb in California.
I did not mean to duck your question.....
You said in one of your posts that I read into something that wasn't there, that what I read on the screen is just words, and that just because you USE CAPS doesn't mean your yelling (though 95% of the online community would probably disagree.)
Soooo, my point was I should not believe what I see, and that CAPS don't mean yelling unless I choose to see them this way, despite my knowledge to the contrary.
When Winston was being interrogated/educated by O'brien in the Ministry of Love in Orwell's 1984, he told Winston that 2+2 does not always = 4 that....
"Sometimes Winston, they are five. Sometimes they are three. Sometimes they are all of them at once. You must try harder. It is not easy to become sane."
I was implying that I was playing Winston to your O'Brien. (ie you telling me I should not believe what I see and interpret as fact.)
So you see, while it may not have fit the perception of the Big Brother, utopian Cliff Notes definition of "Orwellian", I certainly believe it was applied properly here.
LOL It just occurred to me that perhaps we have wandered off topic?
RW
When your bulldog barks and your canary sings, You're out there with winners.. It's good to be King.
Now let's get those bastards trying to tax the crap out of our cigars!
PEACE
RW
Peace! "Talk to you next Tuesday bro."
One of the things I like about cigar smokers is this: When I first started visiting my local B&M cigar shop, I noticed the guys argued alot. Although, they are all (cigar smokers) really nice people.
I asked the owner about this and he said "there is no subject off limits here including politics and religion.
Well, I personally do not discuss politics or religion; it creates division amongst brothers and mankind; it always has, always will. I avoid the two subjects everywhere.
Anyway, you should see these guys at the cigar shop, they will agrue and come as close as you can legally come to murder and mayhem. After they are done smoking a couple stoggies, they shake hands, smile and go home saying "see you next Tuesday bro."
IB Vitola you make a reasonable point. Most of us aren't "pallet educated" enough to distinquish flavors. However, don't be so quick to dismiss the claims. Flavors do exist and on occassion I have picked-up on them myself. Certainly an adequate or even poor cigar is easily criticized by those who have had experience with a better or good cigar. You are right about finding something you enjoy. That is what cigar smoking is about: enjoyment.
Freedom Will Prevail!
Posts: 17 | Location: Wheeling, IL | Registered: August 20, 2007
Originally posted by mbievtea: IB Vitola you make a reasonable point. Most of us aren't "pallet educated" enough to distinquish flavors. However, don't be so quick to dismiss the claims. Flavors do exist and on occassion I have picked-up on them myself. Certainly an adequate or even poor cigar is easily criticized by those who have had experience with a better or good cigar. You are right about finding something you enjoy. That is what cigar smoking is about: enjoyment.
You're right - enjoyment. Just got my hands on a couple of Punch Gran Puro, Libertad, in a cedar lined tubo. I'm keeping them in my humi for about a month to stablize and they promise to be a fine smoke (according to the few reviews I've read), who knows what rubbish lurks in the minds of reviewers!
But keeping on track, I concur with you 100% - it's about enjoying your smoke. I'll report after smoking one (a Punch Gran Puro Libertad) and report my opinion; and it's just that, an opinion - to the "hoi polloi" if they are not too busy with the superfluities of life.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: IB Vitola,
